tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post4738360161278941664..comments2023-04-29T05:50:36.589-04:00Comments on Neshaminy Info: Can you spot the facts?Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger35125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-63898689795037072912010-03-18T19:53:51.455-04:002010-03-18T19:53:51.455-04:00There is a saying that if you make both sides angr...There is a saying that if you make both sides angry then you're doing a good job. Based on C's reaction, I'd say we're doing a great job!<br /><br />Seriously C, hasn't anything this board has done over the past couple of years earned any street cred with you? We are committed to our students and the taxpayers, so give us a chance to see this thing through.<br /><br />Note to Fred - There is no evidence to support your claim of a special bonus, so unless you can provide me with something verifiable, there isn't anything else I can do. Regarding the one particular contract you referenced, you should direct your question/comment to one of the board members who voted in favor of it. I did not. If you have other questions I haven't previously answered, please resubmit them and I'll address what I can.<br /><br />I'm glad you mentioned the NESPA URL, ACS. I want to put that link up on the home page. People should have access to any and all information so they can form their own opinions.<br /><br />I'm leaving on another trip folks so I won't be approving any comments or adding any new posts till middle of next week. You can submit comments but they may not be published until I get back.<br /><br />Peace out!William O'Connorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14176411487253849761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-79304700568483083622010-03-18T18:27:56.694-04:002010-03-18T18:27:56.694-04:00csld, I am sure you read the propaganda on your we...csld, I am sure you read the propaganda on your website but it sounds like you are too smart for it. However, everyone else on William's go to this site and read and you will get an awakening of how out of it NESPA really is:<br /><br />http://www.neshaminyesp.psealocals.org/<br /><br />William has debunked virtually every assertion on this site. The fact is even if the school board was wrong by 50% in savings estimates(and they are not wrong since it is contractual)we would still save a ton and the standards are higher in Private sector than public so we get BETTER not worse service. <br />Alos it is much easier for the district to deal with a private subcontractor then ANY PUBLIC WORKER UNION ON THE PLANET. <br /><br />csld, Read the quotes from Mindy indicating her union workers will be replaced by outside workers. THESE are not true AT ALL based on the contract language the board received.<br />Mindy Quote-<br />"Who are these companies? Will they be bringing people from outside the community in order to save a buck? "<br /><br />Mindy Quote-<br />"Is someone coming from outside the district going to do these things for the community?"<br /><br />Mindy Quote<br />"We work for the district the companies employees WILL NOT." <br /><br />You see csld, she lies to her own members on this site so where is the fairness and integrity from NESPA?<br />There are so many I cannot list them all.<br /><br />But here is her best quote:<br />"A living wage needs to be made to live in this community and the taxpayers of Neshaminy should be able to expect to be paid a living wage by the people they pay their taxes too"<br />Living wage? You have to be kidding. The NESPA workers are overcharging the district by nearly $31.5 M over 5 years. I would say relative to equal wages for exact same private sector services they are making quiet a bit more then "living wage".<br /><br />Mindy you should have taken the first offer you had.....I feel bad for csld and danielle they are really hurt as all the good workers are by union leaders overreaching yet again. Amazing you didn't see this coming with the recession and an anti-union anti tax mood in country.acshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08811500595820652290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-76658416772457208792010-03-18T17:42:17.560-04:002010-03-18T17:42:17.560-04:00Why have you not pulled the trigger on NESPA. The ...Why have you not pulled the trigger on NESPA. The proposed final budget is due 4/6/10 how can you finalize a tax increase if you don't know your final expenses unless you already plan to over tax the taxpayers with an inflated tax increase to cover any type of settlement or non settlement before July.This seems like the old Neshaminy trick of MORE IS BETTER THAN LESS STATUS QUO LET IT FLOW RAISE THE TAXES.Chttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15769878195874863553noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-89220742108098361852010-03-18T15:13:52.389-04:002010-03-18T15:13:52.389-04:00I'll agree that besides First Student, I highl...I'll agree that besides First Student, I highly doubt ANY of the outsourced support staff in the other departments will keep their jobs.<br /><br />I've also only seen Fist Student directly reference rehiring NESPA employees either.JShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02475373367417780007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-17365248003147552312010-03-18T14:55:34.276-04:002010-03-18T14:55:34.276-04:00Mindy et al say it all the time and the letter wri...Mindy et al say it all the time and the letter writers she has writing to the BCCT say it....it is her mantra....she said it in her wild rant at board meeting and the people speaking at board meetings say it everytime. Other than that you are right.acshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08811500595820652290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-25175127083085177572010-03-17T22:01:56.042-04:002010-03-17T22:01:56.042-04:00Hazeleyes what do you mean by this comment
"...Hazeleyes what do you mean by this comment <br />"Interesting that you corrected your facts but none of the nespa followers will admit they are over hyping the cost dangers of outsourcing ".<br />ACS you keep saying that Nespa members are saying they will be losing their jobs but I can tell you I have never heard anyone that I come in contact everyday make this statement they know that they will be retained by the contracted company.csldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09972281774360193787noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-1316307769987960342010-03-17T20:59:06.482-04:002010-03-17T20:59:06.482-04:00Note to Fred - I didn't print your comment bec...Note to Fred - I didn't print your comment because you made a specific reference to a person that I cannot verify at the moment. I will have to look further into it. You raised other points I will address shortly.William O'Connorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14176411487253849761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-70859546827493860782010-03-17T15:19:21.859-04:002010-03-17T15:19:21.859-04:00William, Do not let NESPA and individual staff mem...William, Do not let NESPA and individual staff members get away with continuing to paint this with the brush of "people will lose jobs". The board has gone to great pains to protect jobs by ensuring subcontractor bids take all qualified employees. You need to make sure that word is out and say it over and over. If the community knows truth that they will be retained then they will support the board in pursuing this course which is right for students and taxpayers.acshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08811500595820652290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-11375726119702326342010-03-17T13:09:20.896-04:002010-03-17T13:09:20.896-04:00Interesting that you corrected your facts but none...Interesting that you corrected your facts but none of the nespa followers will admit they are over hyping the cost dangers of outsourcing. I believe in complete honesty but it isn't serving you here Mr. O'Connor because they will never admit to any mistakes they made. It is that prideful stubborness that will land many of them in the unemployment line.<br /><br />As others have said here I do not want to see anyone lose their job but if the choice is between outsourcing and that hideous list then the decision is obvious.<br /><br />I really admire what you are doing for the community. Between this site and facebook you are keeping many hundreds of residents informed of things they would not otherwise pay attention to. Please keep doing what you are doing so that no programs are cut.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05427517000660172872noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-1349626579406538702010-03-17T09:11:59.003-04:002010-03-17T09:11:59.003-04:00Note to jls08 - Although I appreciate your submitt...Note to jls08 - Although I appreciate your submitting a comment, it didn't abide by the Blog rules of civility. In the future, please try to avoid any comments which are insulting and that don't contribute to the discussion.<br /><br />Thank you!<br />WilliamWilliam O'Connorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14176411487253849761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-26819431383330000742010-03-16T14:20:57.240-04:002010-03-16T14:20:57.240-04:00The retirement is a component of savings but the r...The retirement is a component of savings but the real and actual savings is recurring cost of salary, healthcare and bus ownership. There is really no way to compare NESPA cost to outsourcing. Apples to oranges. Also pnsion cost for Full TIme nespa pails as compared to NFT members. As I look at it even if you tried to keep bus assets NESPA would still a big premium cost to taxpayers for Healthcare and retirement.acshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08811500595820652290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-68409124642877085872010-03-16T13:50:52.244-04:002010-03-16T13:50:52.244-04:00Thanks JS. As usual you explained something much b...Thanks JS. As usual you explained something much better than I did. I knew I kept you around for a reason :-)William O'Connorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14176411487253849761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-51840132540147602052010-03-16T13:46:25.247-04:002010-03-16T13:46:25.247-04:00Danielle, I couldn’t help but notice you started o...Danielle, I couldn’t help but notice you started off your comment claiming you were about to give facts, then you offered up supposition stated as if it were fact. This is exactly the objection I have to NESPA’s Ad which misleads people into believing outsourcing will lead to more costly contracts. But enough about that, allow me to address a couple of the points you raised:<br /><br />1. Our Motives – You can choose to believe whatever you want, that these negotiations are over benefits or retirement or whatever. It doesn’t change the big picture, which is what we are focused on. Our labor contracts are extremely expensive, and each year the costs to support these CBA’s propel our budget beyond the Act 1 inflationary limit. Either we cut labor expenses or we cut student programs. <br />2. Paying our fair share – Do you really understand how the funding of this retirement system came to be? It was not a school district decision, it was a Harrisburg decision. And not a particularly good one. Any money we were spared from paying into the retirement system went directly to our bottom line to offset operational expenses. Had previous boards set aside that money as some have suggested, our tax increases would have been greater and more unaffordable years ago, and that would have drawn attention to our high labor costs sooner. Maybe that would have been a good thing because it would have forced previous school boards to negotiate the former CBA’s more aggressively. But the undeniable reality of the situation is that all of us were going to have to deal with the cost of our CBA’s sooner or later. Thanks to Harrisburg, you were spared the pain for a few years but that only served to make things worse.<br /><br />Believe me, I wish we weren’t going through all this. Do you think any of us really jump for joy at the prospects of outsourcing if we are unable to reach an agreement with NESPA? I could sit here all day wishing that previous boards negotiated a more cost effective agreement years ago but that doesn’t change the facts, and this goes back to #1 above … Either we cut labor expenses or we cut student programs. Neither option is pleasant to think about but cutting student programs isn’t something I’m prepared to do.William O'Connorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14176411487253849761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-14524303819743442512010-03-16T13:33:28.429-04:002010-03-16T13:33:28.429-04:00Yes, Danielle the fact that there would be less pe...Yes, Danielle the fact that there would be less pension contributions is an important factor. That's part of why the District would save so much by outsourcing.<br /><br />The truth is there are 500 some odd school districts and only 1% are paid into their pension requirements. The reason?<br /><br />Back in 2001 the state lawmakers gave themselves a 50% pension increase. To keep other state pension employees (that would include some of NESPA employees) quiet they gave them a 25% pension increase. I don't seem to see you blaming PSERS members for taking that increase do I?<br /><br />Now to keep everyone else quiet in the state they lowered the employer contribution rates. It would not have gone well if state taxes got raised because of all these pension increases, not smart politically. So School Districts paid into the fund EXACTLY what they were told to.<br /><br />Maybe our Business Manager should have been smart enough to see that we were in serious trouble if the market ever crashed, but something really odd happened back in 2002. A Cadillac of a contract was given to the NFT, thus wiping out pretty much any savings from those lowered contribution rates.<br /><br />Neshaminy is not alone in the fact that pension contribution rates will jump to 33% in coming years. Like I said 99% of districts are in the same boat.<br /><br />I am not saying that money that was contributed by employees is not owed to them, but I don't see anyone volunteering to give back that 25% pension raise either.<br /><br />Danielle, I'm sorry, but welcome to the real world where economics actually drive labor decisions. Just be glad Neshaminy bucked that trend this long or outsourcing might have happened years ago. How long has CR outsourced busing after all?JShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02475373367417780007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-17112456187861765942010-03-16T11:36:56.485-04:002010-03-16T11:36:56.485-04:00ok well if facts are what you want then here are a...ok well if facts are what you want then here are a few! William when is the board going to admit that the main reason they want to outsource the support staff really has little to do with benefits but really is because of retirement. Because the district did not pay their fair share like the employees and now are trying to save the tax payers pardon my french but from a bill from hell! When are you going to address that and that one of the reasons the union did not accept your off was because it was a 3 year contract stating that you could outsource at anytime and how funny Iam sure it would have been before the 2012 hike..that by the way was caused by who? Thats right the ones that were not paying there share. So where also did that money go that wasn't being paid. Oh into a high school that has problems already because it was rushed.. how about the other day when the power was out and the gates came down and locked kids in..fire hazard I would say! But that is besides the point the point is there are more reasons this is all going on and it is not just because of benefits lets be real finally! I do and will continue to go to school board meetings so hope to see the rest of you there!Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14638284598259750301noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-11945573953429531772010-03-16T09:28:03.706-04:002010-03-16T09:28:03.706-04:00William, Thanks good job in editing. The hour was ...William, Thanks good job in editing. The hour was late but I do not think I said aything inappropriate just listed a few facts laced with a bit of opinion for Danielle but really not bad stuff. Some of the points I thought added clarity but you are the boss of us :)acshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08811500595820652290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-67597403018169484552010-03-16T08:09:15.621-04:002010-03-16T08:09:15.621-04:00One of my new Facebook "fans" admonished...One of my new Facebook "fans" admonished me for not considering the Ad's statement about negotiating a fair premium co-pay as factual. It is true that NESPA did make a counter offer to contribute as much as 5% towards their monthly health care costs, but I didn't consider this a "fair" offer since they were also asking for higher salary increases that would have all but wiped out any savings resulting from their contributions. The name of the game here is reducing expenses, and if we aren't doing that then it's all just talk.<br /><br />So while I may not have considered it a reasonable offer, I do want to acknowledge that NESPA did say they would contribute something towards health care costs.<br /><br />Now that I've cleared that up, I hope this same FB Fan (and other NESPA rank and file) will admit that their claims of "more costly contracts" from outsourcing are baseless, and are nothing more than a fear tactic. That is, unless someone can produce a historical study that proves otherwise.William O'Connorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14176411487253849761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-48545915887735318332010-03-16T07:58:13.653-04:002010-03-16T07:58:13.653-04:00The following comments submitted by ACS have been ...<b>The following comments submitted by <i>ACS</i> have been edited for content</b>.<br /><br />Danielle, Again no one loses their jobs PERIOD unless they deserve to. <br /><br />You elected [Mindy Anderson] to be YOUR voice so you can't come on here and hide behind "non of us have control" she is representing your will and unrealistic demands<br /><br />People on this blog have been very sympathetic to the staff as human beings and do not bash anyone so relax if you want to play here. and I have said this several times there are not enough administration to lay off to save $31.5M like outsourcing does.<br /><br />The only way to save yourselves from outsourcing is to get NFT to take the boards offer also then the combined savings is close to the private bids for services<br /><br />YOU DON'T LOSE YOUR JOB SO STOP SAYING THIS PLEASE.William O'Connorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14176411487253849761noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-47722126664416632692010-03-15T21:13:57.799-04:002010-03-15T21:13:57.799-04:00Danielle your right I dont know you personally but...Danielle your right I dont know you personally but I do know this if you were so hell bent on paying for your benefits then you should of told your union.You know what we can go round and round on this and get no where.All I know is that all the part timers are in this postion because the fulltimers did not want to pay for their benefits or they were willing to pay but they wanted to keep the cadillac plan they have.Who do you know in this day and age pays 5 dollars to go to the doctor .My spouse works for a big company and we dont pay 5 dollars.The offer that our union put before the board about no raises for the first year so the full timers dont have to pay for the benefits the first year...Where does that leave the part timers.This has been about the fulltimers from the beginning.<br />Danielle I have a question for you why do you think this is all the boards fault that we are in this position? I do not make 100,000 a year either but I do know this the raises that the higher up got was the same offer we got .I can tell you that every parttimer I know would love to go in front of the board and say we will gladly take that offer.What was about the offer that you did not like if it wasnt the paying of the benefits.I dont hide behind my letters I just speak the truth and I am sorry it hurts.<br />Also my mother and a few other close people died of cancer and at no time did I take offense to that comment.<br />JS I don't know what is going to happen to Mindy when this is all over I would think there wont be a union once the services are outsourced .<br />ACS once this is over and if my job is outsourced I still will have a job it probably at a lower rate of pay but I still will have a job.csldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09972281774360193787noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-47147846950612029742010-03-15T18:40:54.800-04:002010-03-15T18:40:54.800-04:00really csld you don't know crap about me and I...really csld you don't know crap about me and I'll tell you what I NEVER refused or said I would not pay for my health benefits so before you run your mouth and hide behind some letters get your facts straight about me because I want my job and would pay for benefits. So wow to you too JS get your facts about what I've said first. To all of you who thought the cancer comment was funny I surely hope you never had anyone who has died from it or battled it in your family, in VERY POOR taste not funny at all! I will take a chill pill when the support staff stops getting bashed because not all of us have control over what is going on. Start trimming the fat from the top, I don't make 100,000 plus!Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14638284598259750301noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-21606833839057209282010-03-15T16:49:38.590-04:002010-03-15T16:49:38.590-04:00Hats off to tiredparent! You remind me why I'm...Hats off to tiredparent! You remind me why I'm glad I only have one child = )<br /><br />Wouldn't it be poetic justice if food services keeps their jobs but the secretaries lose theirs? I wouldn't wish job loss on anyone but kharma finds a way to even things out. It could happen!<br /><br />I'm thinking good thoughts for you and your co workers csld.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09514219247817275588noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-84126977962135971892010-03-15T16:22:56.369-04:002010-03-15T16:22:56.369-04:00csld, Why is it the union wants to keep propagatin...csld, Why is it the union wants to keep propagating the MYTH that workers lose their jobs. The bids are quite clear that satisfactory employees are fully retained. You may not like pay and benefit cost but you still have a job to the tune of 90% of workers. Do you think an outsourcer has people laying around to take you jobs? No they take the district employees unless they are crappy workers or don't pass drug/background checks sothen who cares about those anyway since it is only 10-20% maybe. <br />We are all getting very tired of Mindy whining and lying to everyone including her members. You all should get a new union leader if the union survives that is.acshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08811500595820652290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-81982561320855372732010-03-15T16:13:46.639-04:002010-03-15T16:13:46.639-04:00Wow, Danielle called out by a fellow union member....Wow, Danielle called out by a fellow union member.<br /><br />CSLD, I feel bad for you and others who understand the issues and the choices that should have been made. I really wish there were some way for specific departmens (in your case Food Service) to settle independantly so that you don't have to be sacrificed by those not fearing for their jobs.JShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02475373367417780007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-8152785505171880652010-03-15T15:15:37.528-04:002010-03-15T15:15:37.528-04:00Danielle you can not blame William If I am not mis...Danielle you can not blame William If I am not mistaking you are a fulltime employee and as far as I am concerned you have no one to blame but our union and your fellow fulltime coworkers who refused to pay for their benefits.The ad is a joke as far as I am concerned it says alot of nothing in fact I am annoyed that my union dues went to probably pay for this ad .This union should of took the first offer and ran with it.Now because they thought they could win we now stand to lose our jobs.So before you place blame you need to look at our union and yourself and other fulltime employees who thought that they can go without paying part of their benefits like 98 percent of the country does.csldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09972281774360193787noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4332946972319732703.post-27758406879303068862010-03-15T14:27:09.816-04:002010-03-15T14:27:09.816-04:00JS, By the way, NESPA can make an offer with many ...JS, By the way, NESPA can make an offer with many more concessions than the board had in the original offer they rejected and beg the board to accept it and unless it isvery close to the outsourcer bid pricing(which it can't be due to sale of buses being included)the board is not obligated at all to accept it. They can then move on to outsourcing all or some of services.acshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08811500595820652290noreply@blogger.com